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Here's a tally - as of now, via CNN - of all of the ballot measures that aim at limiting the rights of gay couples, with a few other key ballot initiatives thrown in, mostly aimed at women's rights:

ARIZONA: PROPOSITION 102: BANNING GAY MARRIAGE - 57-47, yes, 85% reported
FLORIDA: AMENDMENT 2: BANNING GAY MARRIAGE - 62-38, yes, 95% reported (60% necessary)
MICHIGAN: PROPOSITION 2: ALLOWING STEM-CELL RESEARCH - 52-48, yes, 74% reported (Go Michigan!)

All in all... some good things, but every single initiative aimed at hurting homosexuals is going to pass.

I find it funny that on a day we elected a black President, we're still very obviously biased against homosexuals. We still want to criminalize them, and we're using fear and hatred to do it. What bothers me is that this is a fight against organized religion. Organized religion enjoys tax-free status, yet actively campaigns, usually very aggressively, for their own agenda, and as stated by Barry Goldwater, these people are, in their minds, speaking for God, so they cannot and will not be flexible or reasonable; they're lost. They're nuts.

Yes, we've come far tonight. But we're not there yet. Not yet. And from the looks of things, not for awhile.

EDIT: EVERYONE! OUT OF MY POOL! The dispute between Paul and I is between Paul and I. Stay out of it, because though I'm annoyed, I still respect the man greatly.


Nov. 5th, 2008 06:27 am (UTC)
The only two conservatives who actually READ you as far as I can tell are myself and Dale, and this is the third fucking entry I have read of yours today making me feel bad by association, with the rest of your reader base agreeing with you 100%. Having read this rant more than once, and having had to put up with this american election for two years, I am somewhat sick of hearing about this.

I am not going to apologise for being sick to death about feeling this way either. The drama that temporarily taking you off my flist would create for however temporary a reprieve from this bullshit is not worth it, but neither is having to put up with it for what may be days when I am honestly not in the best mental shape from my job.
Nov. 5th, 2008 06:33 am (UTC)
Hi Will.

Things like this make me glad you're Canadian. :)
Nov. 5th, 2008 06:38 am (UTC)
Bitch, who the fuck are you? Out with you.

EDIT: BTW, originally from Saskatchewan.

Edited at 2008-11-05 06:39 am (UTC)
Nov. 5th, 2008 06:43 am (UTC)
It's not that I'm judging Canadians, I'm judging Will for being an asshole who has continually, in the past week or so, made judgmental opinions on people who are outside of his views for merely saying them.

I'm Sam's (hezul) roommate. She mentioned he was being a dick, I popped in. I'm tired of people bitching about contrasting point of views when they're allowing people to be themselves, and supporting that. After we've done something so well, he's bitching. This is when he should turn off the computer and let the rest of us fret.

That's the bottom-line. I was opinionated, I said my part, that's it. But sorry for popping in.
Nov. 5th, 2008 06:47 am (UTC)
Well, my mistake on being confused, I thought Will's friends were popping in (which would be uninvited on his part; he's above that). I reacted to that, and I apologize.

Still, I do maintain what I said above; this is between Paul and I, and I would ask everyone getting involved, including Sam, to please keep it that way.

EDIT: I think Paul's being less judgemental than he is just defending himself; I think he feels his entire lifestyle is under attack. And I might have reacted the same way if I saw things the past three weeks that said that, for instance, everyone that voted for Prop 8/Amendment 2 was a sinner and going to hell.

I disagree with him. That's all. And I don't hold this spat against him.

Edited at 2008-11-05 06:48 am (UTC)
(no subject) - trinities - Nov. 5th, 2008 07:05 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - superbus - Nov. 5th, 2008 07:17 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - otosaretatenshi - Nov. 5th, 2008 11:45 pm (UTC) - Expand
Nov. 5th, 2008 06:34 am (UTC)
The drama that temporarily taking you off my flist would create for however temporary a reprieve from this bullshit is not worth it, but neither is having to put up with it for what may be days when I am honestly not in the best mental shape from my job.

Not to butt in, but. What I usually do to solve this is I take someone temporarily off of my reading list -- I've got a filter set up that usually includes everyone (it takes a little custom CSS to set it up so that it replaces the default friends' page link, but in the end, it's worth it to have that freedom/peace of mind), but when I find something really unsettling, I'll take someone off of that filter until I'm fairly sure they'll be "over it" -- usually, a couple of days.

That way, no drama and no stress.

Edited at 2008-11-05 06:34 am (UTC)
Nov. 5th, 2008 06:36 am (UTC)
Lol, I was waiting for "put a filter in" and was like :where's the comment? Oh there it is!"
Nov. 5th, 2008 06:38 am (UTC)
I have done this to people who I have absolutely no respect for (usually followed by being removed from the person's flist anyway). If I get to the point where I have to do it to someone I would actually still want to read after a certain amount of time, I am upfront enough to notify them I am actually not reading them.
Nov. 5th, 2008 06:40 am (UTC)
I tell people too -- I usually say it's because I don't want to fight with them about it -- but I still do it when I just don't feel like I can really stop myself from commenting in a pointlessly inflammatory manner. And then once that's over with, we're usually right back to being friends.
(no subject) - superbus - Nov. 5th, 2008 06:43 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - shotglass - Nov. 5th, 2008 06:44 am (UTC) - Expand
Nov. 5th, 2008 06:36 am (UTC)
I don't mean this to be rude, but by friending someone's journal, I think it's understood that they are going to be talking about things that are important to them, the way they feel about things, et cetera. In commenting on someone's journal you are entering their space.

I'm not saying that you can't be sick of what you're hearing from one direction or another, but nobody is writing their journal for an audience of you.

Two years is a long time to hear about an election in a country that isn't yours, but it's immensely important to those of us who live here, and for all that sometimes I'm sick of hearing about it myself, on a night like this when two years of tension and anticipation are coming together, I think a post flood is to be expected. No matter how much or little anyone else cares, this is important to us, very important to us. We are going to talk about it. And we are probably going to offend people about it, because the political is personal, and you know as well as I that Chris is not one to mince words about how he feels.

I do think that observing a certain level of tact is important in these things, yes. But emotions are the highest they've been in this country for quite a while.

I'm sorry to intrude on this thread, but I feel it needs to be said.
Nov. 5th, 2008 06:37 am (UTC)
And haven't I always treated yours and Dale's views with respect? No, I do not like how we're treating homosexuals in this country. And no, I don't agree with you on that (I'm not sure where Dale stands on this specific issue). Your reason is religiously based, and I think that's a poor reasoning to affect someone else's life, as well as - this is key, I don't care if it's marriage, a union, whatever - the legal rights that come with the union. There is NO reason why a homosexual couple shouldn't have full legal rights that a heterosexual couple can get that is not based around religion. None.

I respect your view. I also think you're wrong. There is a difference.

Look, don't like it? Create a separate friends filter and read that filter, because frankly, I'm not going to stop. I feel strongly about this issue, and frankly, it's my journal, my pulpit, and if you don't like it, skip over it, because I frankly don't give a fuck about your mental state in regards to my political views.
Nov. 5th, 2008 06:42 am (UTC)
I replied above my reasons why I don't make a seperate filter.

However, my views on this are the same as yours, somewhat. HOWEVER, EVERYONE I associate with... do not share these views! It becomes immensely annoying and frustrating--across the entire board of people I hang out with online--of having the people I hang out with every day being called the most evil people on the face of the earth. By everyone I read!
Nov. 5th, 2008 06:45 am (UTC)
Paul, you know I don't consider people that have these views, and have thought about them greatly, and are reasonable, like that. If I did, all my friends would be like Samantha, and Heather, and everyone else that happens to read my LJ (remember, most of my more conservative friends don't have Livejournal, or don't read it)

It's the extremists that concern me. There is no reason in those people. And they're the ones I feel like we have to fight against. If your friends are like you, then great, I can reason with them. If they're the latter... I cannot.
(no subject) - willfor_iv - Nov. 5th, 2008 06:48 am (UTC) - Expand
Nov. 5th, 2008 06:46 am (UTC)
Also, I will withdraw with tattered dignity here, since I only really have the mental power to deal with ONE person tonight, and this has escalated somewhat.
Nov. 5th, 2008 06:49 am (UTC)
I've asked - no, demanded - that it not do that. But since I'm sure you're feeling pressure outside of my journal, I'll accept that.

Don't let this tatter your dignity; I don't hold anything here against you when all is said and done.
(no subject) - willfor_iv - Nov. 5th, 2008 07:00 am (UTC) - Expand